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GoDores
03-28-2016, 09:52 AM
Here is my order:

1. Greg Marshall, Wichita St.- Have to make the call. He's got a good set up at Wichita. I think makes $3M. Timing is interesting because his seniors Baker and VanVleet are gone. Maybe he's ready to move on too and take a P5 job. Nashville would offer a lot more than Wichita. Could be holding out for an elite job down the road.

2. Will Wade, VCU- Coached at Harvard and was recruiting coordinator around 2008 when they had some really good classes, so can handle the academic requirements. Coached under Shaka Smart, which I like. Won multiple conference titles and COY. Is from Nashville and parents still live here. Grew up going to Vandy basketball games with his parents. He's young. He's been successful at every stop as a head coach. Downside - limited sample size as a head coach.

That's as far down as I'd like to go. Here's some other names some media and reporters have put out. I think this is all just speculation right now:

-Bryce Drew, Valpo
-Rick Byrd, Belmont (Not gonna happen)
-Buzz Williams, Va Tech
-Tommy Amaker, Hardvard (I'd pass)
-Chris Holtman, Butler
-James Jones, Yale
-Archie Miller, Dayton

It'll be interesting to see if any names pop up that aren't on anyone's radar.

GoDores
03-28-2016, 10:19 AM
Coaching searches are fun. Let the speculation begin. Vandy is in Wichita this morning. Landed at 7:43 am. Bringing us back a coach?

https://flightaware.com/live/flight/N111Y
Date Aircraft Origin Destination Departure Arrival Duration
28-Mar-2016 C680/L Nashville Intl (KBNA) Wichita Dwight D Eisenhower National (KICT) 06:08AM CDT 07:43AM CDT 1:35



Aircraft Registration (N111Y) https://flightaware.com/resources/registration/N111Y

Aircraft Summary
Summary2007 CESSNA 680
Fixed wing multi engine
(9 seats / 2 engines)
OwnerINGRAM INDUSTRIES INC
NASHVILLE , TN, US
(Corporation)
AirworthinessStandard/Transport
Serial Number680-0127
EngineP&W CANADA PW306C (Turbo-fan)
Thrust: 6040lbs
WeightOver 20,000lbs
SpeedNot defined
Mode S Code050031020 / A03210

Dawgilicious
03-28-2016, 10:43 AM
Archie isn't leaving Dayton, especially since he just cashed in. Byrd would be good, but prob not gonna happen like u said

GoDores
03-28-2016, 10:56 AM
Yea, I'm not buying Archie as a candidate either.

GoDores
03-28-2016, 12:13 PM
Update: Vandy plane still in Wichita. Been there for 3.5 hours now.

Also, Vandy has a press conference in Memorial Gym scheduled for 3 today. No one is expecting a coaching announcement to be made then though.

But I'm not against the Easter Bunny delivering a day late.

Dawgilicious
03-28-2016, 12:42 PM
apparently this must be getting done in pure quietness because none of the other basketball pundits have tweeted or reported anything about Vandy and Marshall even talking....lol

GoDores
03-28-2016, 01:13 PM
Vandy can keep things under wraps pretty tight. The last football hire was really quiet.

But new development: a sports reporter in Wichita says Gregg Marshall is out of town on vacation so he doesn't know the purpose of the Vandy plane in Wichita.

You could made a TV show out of coaching searches.

I would also just like to point out for the record that Penn St hired James Franklin when he was out of town on vacation.

SCgamecock2988
03-29-2016, 09:05 AM
I'll be quite jelly of Vandy if they land Marshall.

Dawgilicious
03-29-2016, 11:10 AM
Will Wade just agreed to an 8 year extension with VCU........Don't think he is going to Vandy

GoDores
03-29-2016, 12:21 PM
Interesting timing there. Wonder what happened with the buyout in this new deal?
If VCU offered the extension the only way you don't sign is if you know you're going to be offered the Vandy job. He either heard what Vandy had to say and passed or made a really big safety net. It'd be a bold move though to leave a school you've only been at a year after signing an extension.

Hopefully Vandy did at least reach out to him. One big hurdle I saw with Wade was that he was head coach at Chattanooga for 2 years and at VCU for one. Timing may not have been right for him to take another job.

Dawgilicious
03-29-2016, 12:23 PM
Not sure about all the talk, but I am sure vandy reached out and he thought it was best for him to stay at VCU. who knows though

GoDores
03-29-2016, 05:05 PM
Not as exciting today as yesterday. Vandy plane is still in Wichita.

Some national media guys now saying Vandy is going after Gregg Marshall.

GoDores
03-29-2016, 06:43 PM
Jeff Capel's name emerging as a candidate. Not sure how I feel about that one. I wouldn't be upset if Ga Tech scooped him up first.

Dawgilicious
03-30-2016, 08:05 AM
I think Mike Lonergan would be a great fit for Vandy, but they may not be as interested in him

GoDores
03-30-2016, 12:00 PM
I've wondered about him too. His record shows he's built his teams up pretty good everywhere he's been. I wouldn't be surprised if he's on the list but maybe a little further down.

kentubbybasketball
03-30-2016, 02:37 PM
I think Mike Lonergan would be a great fit for Vandy, but they may not be as interested in him

IMO, if you go from Stallings to Lonergan have you really improved. IMO, when you fire the guy who is going to be known as your most successful coach in school history you hire somebody better than Mike Lonergan. That's similar to Pitt replacing Dixon for Stallings and UK replacing Tubby with G.

Dawgilicious
03-30-2016, 02:42 PM
I am not sure if they can lure a top flight coach to Nashville. Will Wade is off the table, I am not sure Marshall is leaving Wichita.....so where does that leave them?

The pool they are most likely swimming in is going to be non P5 coaches who have good results, but haven't been given great opportunities. I think vandy is looking for someone who can provide more consistency

Whomever it is will have to replace Baldwin and Jones, maybe even others the longer this goes.

GoDores
03-30-2016, 02:59 PM
I don't base the decision on Stallings by who the new coach will be. We could hire Johnny Jones and it still wouldn't change the fact that it was time for Vandy and Stallings to part ways.

Whole lotta rumors out right now. I'd imagine we'll get pretty narrowed in here by next week after the final four.

kentubbybasketball
03-30-2016, 03:13 PM
I am not sure if they can lure a top flight coach to Nashville. Will Wade is off the table, I am not sure Marshall is leaving Wichita.....so where does that leave them?

The pool they are most likely swimming in is going to be non P5 coaches who have good results, but haven't been given great opportunities. I think vandy is looking for someone who can provide more consistency

Whomever it is will have to replace Baldwin and Jones, maybe even others the longer this goes.

This isn't firing some coach that just wasn't working out though. Stallings was in the NCAAT field this past year. If you're willingly letting them go, you better go out and get somebody better.

Dawgilicious
03-30-2016, 03:20 PM
They didnt really fire him though, did they? I thought he left and took the Pitt job. Sometimes you take a chance on a guy where you believe his beliefs and standards will work well with your program. I can understand Vandy fans' frustrations, especially after this season. Sometimes new blood will bring new passion

kentubbybasketball
03-30-2016, 03:22 PM
They didnt really fire him though, did they? I thought he left and took the Pitt job. Sometimes you take a chance on a guy where you believe his beliefs and standards will work well with your program. I can understand Vandy fans' frustrations, especially after this season. Sometimes new blood will bring new passion
It's up for debate. Semantics really. They weren't trying to keep him either. Some even say, if he hadn't found a job in X days, he would be forced to resign or get fired.

All I'm saying is you get tired of a coach with an NCAAT appearance in his final year, what do you do when the next coach isn't even making the NIT consistently. Ask Miss. St. fans.

Dawgilicious
03-30-2016, 04:13 PM
I am sure it is about the last 3-4 years rather than just this season. That is up to the Vandy administration because they ultimately have to answer those questions. 17 seasons and he made the NCAAT 7 times. I am guessing that the AD and his crew have other goals in mind and think there is someone better for the future of the program. We will see whom they get and what direction they want to go

GoDores
03-30-2016, 05:35 PM
Keeping Stallings would have been settling at this point. Ticket sales have been on a steady decline ever since 2012. They picked back up this season a little given the high expectations, but this season was a dud and you bet ticket sales would have plummeted if Stallings was back next year.

Go back and look at the track record over his entire tenure. His seat started to get warm in 2004, then they pulled off a Sweet 16 as a 6 seed. Then a few more dud years and he was back on the hot seat in 07. That year they pulled off another Sweet 16 as a 6 seed to quiet the naysayers. Then you have a pretty good stretch from 08-11 in terms of seasons, but you get upset 3 straight times as a 4 seed in the NCAA first round. Then the senior laden team in 2012 that started preseason top 10, another disappointing season where people were saying it was time for a change. But then for a weekend the team plays to its potential and wins the SECT and it buys Stallings more time. 3 more non NCAA tournement years after that as we built towards this past season that was supposed to make it all worth it and we sneak in to the NCAAT and get blown out in the play-in game. Stallings didn't have a run in him this year to save his job.


Vanderbilt Commodores (Southeastern Conference) (1999–2016)
1999–00 Vanderbilt 19–11 8–8 4th (East) NIT First Round
2000–01 Vanderbilt 15–15 4–12 6th (East)
2001–02 Vanderbilt 17–15 6–10 T–5th (East) NIT Second Round
2002–03 Vanderbilt 11–18 3–13 6th (East)
2003–04 Vanderbilt 23–10 8–8 T–3rd (East) NCAA Sweet Sixteen
2004–05 Vanderbilt 20–14 8–8 3rd (East) NIT Second Round
2005–06 Vanderbilt 17–13 7–9 4th (East) NIT First Round
2006–07 Vanderbilt 22–12 10–6 2nd (East) NCAA Sweet Sixteen
2007–08 Vanderbilt 26–8 10–6 3rd (East) NCAA First Round
2008–09 Vanderbilt 19–12 8–8 T–4th (East)
2009–10 Vanderbilt 24–9 12–4 2nd (East) NCAA First Round
2010–11 Vanderbilt 23–11 9–7 T–3rd (East) NCAA Second Round
2011–12 Vanderbilt 25–11 10–6 T–2nd NCAA Third Round
2012–13 Vanderbilt 16–17 8–10 10th
2013–14 Vanderbilt 15–16 7–11 T–10th
2014–15 Vanderbilt 21–14 9–9 7th NIT Quarterfinals
2015–16 Vanderbilt 19–14 11–7 T–3rd NCAA First Four

kentubbybasketball
03-30-2016, 07:24 PM
I'm curious to every Vandy season record prior to Stallings....

Wave&Dawgs
03-30-2016, 08:41 PM
It's up for debate. Semantics really. They weren't trying to keep him either. Some even say, if he hadn't found a job in X days, he would be forced to resign or get fired.

All I'm saying is you get tired of a coach with an NCAAT appearance in his final year, what do you do when the next coach isn't even making the NIT consistently. Ask Miss. St. fans.

I still don't mind that we got rid of Stans as he was kinda letting the program get out of control, but yeah the hire to replace him wound up being a disaster. But since it eventually turned into Howland I can't complain too much.

kentubbybasketball
03-30-2016, 09:09 PM
That's the thing though, what does Howland guarantee? With Stans you had a guarantee 20 win season and an SECW title every other year at least. Howland has a good class coming but that's still not a guarantee of being better than what Stans was.

GoDores
03-30-2016, 09:14 PM
I'm curious to every Vandy season record prior to Stallings....

The 4 years before Stallings produced 1 ncaat, 2 nits, and a losing record. The four years before that, the exact same.

But that's completely irrelevant. The Vandy job today is not the Vandy job of then. Vandy today is better administration, better facilities, bigger money, more exposure. Nashville itself is one of the top cities in the nation- huge growth over the past 2 decades.

kentubbybasketball
03-30-2016, 09:50 PM
Why is Vandy a better job now.












Two qords: Kevin Stallings?????????

GoDores
03-30-2016, 10:32 PM
And you can go re-read the other thread where I literally wrote that Kevin Stallings has elevated the program.

GoDores
03-31-2016, 11:29 AM
More rumblings today about Gregg Marshall. $4M number being thrown around. Hope it's true.

kentubbybasketball
03-31-2016, 02:53 PM
Now if you can get Gregg Marshall, I would understand letting Stallings go. The other thing that makes me sorta believe it is the fact that Marshall is a Southern guy. Of the two main jobs open in the south, this one is better than Ga Tech due to competition. Recruiting-wise I'm not sure Marshall would love the restrictions at Vandy. But, given its the end of an era at WSU, maybe he is looking to leave. But, to go from WSU to Vandy seems lateral at best IMO.

GoDores
03-31-2016, 03:27 PM
I like how it is viewed as recruiting restrictions because Vandy emphasizes the academic part of being a student athlete. That is a really overblown argument. We're talking about finding 3-4 kids a year who play high level basketball and also take academics seriously. It's not that tough. Are there basketball recruits that Vandy can't/doesn't go after because they can't cut it at Vandy? Absolutely. But more often than not, I don't want those kids at Vandy anyways.

If you want to call it restrictions, I'll counter with Vandy can offer what no other SEC school can. You can play in the SEC and in 3-4 years have a degree from a top 20 university. I forget the exact statistics, but that degree is a fast track to a 6 figure income on average.

kentubbybasketball
03-31-2016, 03:45 PM
Kudos... at UK we don't typically worry about players playing for 3 to 4 years. If Vandy is talking about a 3 or 4 year plan, that's my point. You're not recruiting in the same circles as the Dukes, Arizonas. Duke finds a way to do it BTW. These guys that end up playing basketball overseas that are going to other SEC schools are making 6 figures also BTW. Our guys at UK since Cal has been here have made just under $400 million fwiw. IT will surpass $1 billion in 5-7 years, so that number about six figures pales in comparison if we are trying to make comparisons.

But, ultimately, that's not the point I'm making. Marshall is known for being heavily reliant on JUCOs. That ain't flying at Vandy. YOU ARE RESTRICTED FROM THAT. Things like that are allowed to happen at other schools. Everything doesn't have to be taken as an insult. Good grief.

NCMISSSTFAN
03-31-2016, 04:01 PM
Good points KT, I honestly completely forgot about Vandy's restrictions on grades, JUCO's etc. That does make it a lot tougher to get the top tier athletes....its not impossible, but its not an easy thing to do on a steady basis.

kentubbybasketball
03-31-2016, 04:51 PM
And, let's face it, every SEC school has relied on JUCOs over the years. Auburn's best season the past two decades was with JUCO Chris Porter. Vandy not doing that hurts, especially when they aren't on a typical 4 or 5 star recruit's radar anyway.

dnmuga93
04-01-2016, 11:01 AM
And, let's face it, every SEC school has relied on JUCOs over the years. Auburn's best season the past two decades was with JUCO Chris Porter. Vandy not doing that hurts, especially when they aren't on a typical 4 or 5 star recruit's radar anyway.

KT, I honestly couldn't tell you the last JUCO player on Georgia's roster. The Hayes twins played a year at Western Carolina and then transferred to Athens.

Other than them, I'm not certain who our last transfer in was.

Just remembered the infamous Tony Cole. I think he was a JUCO guy.

kentubbybasketball
04-01-2016, 02:51 PM
KT, I honestly couldn't tell you the last JUCO player on Georgia's roster. The Hayes twins played a year at Western Carolina and then transferred to Athens.

Other than them, I'm not certain who our last transfer in was.

Just remembered the infamous Tony Cole. I think he was a JUCO guy.

Cameron Forte who was on your 2015 team came from a JUCO.

dnmuga93
04-01-2016, 03:36 PM
Cameron Forte who was on your 2015 team came from a JUCO.

True. Completely forgot about him.

GoDores
04-01-2016, 04:32 PM
I hesitate to even post this because these are a whole lot more rumors than reports, but if you believe the word, Vandy has at least 3 candidates they are pursuing: Gregg Marshall, Tom Crean, and Bryce Drew. Tom Crean is the biggest rumor of the 3. I feel pretty good about Vandy's rumored contact with the other 2.

But Vandy has been Fort Knox apparently. The expectation, or at least hope, is that this will really advance after Final Four weekend.

Wave&Dawgs
04-02-2016, 11:40 AM
That's the thing though, what does Howland guarantee? With Stans you had a guarantee 20 win season and an SECW title every other year at least. Howland has a good class coming but that's still not a guarantee of being better than what Stans was.

A couple of exaggerations here. Stans didn't win 20 every single year and they won the SECW in 5 of his 14 seasons. Not to say he was horrible by any means, but he wasn't exactly guaranteeing us success every year.

Then you also have to consider the fact that they only made the NCAAT in 2 of his last 7 seasons there, and one of those was as a 13 seed after that miracle SECT run.

Also, the fact that since being fired at MSU he had to take an assistant job and could only get a school like WKU as a head coach should tell you all you need to know. If his coaching was some guarantee of success like you claim, P5 schools would be tripping over themselves to hire him.

GoDores
04-02-2016, 02:56 PM
Bryce Drew to Georgia Tech. The mystery with the Vandy job grows.

kentubbybasketball
04-02-2016, 04:19 PM
Wave, we didn't have divisions all 14 of Stans' years but further he won more SECW titles than anybody, which is my point. That's pretty good for MSU. You guys gave that up.

BTW, you do realize that your current coach got fired at UCLA right and only could get MSU to hire him. Pot meet kettle.

kentubbybasketball
04-02-2016, 04:20 PM
Bryce Drew to Georgia Tech. The mystery with the Vandy job grows.

Vandy is a better job than GA Tech by every measure. The only thing that's better at Tech is the recruiting base. The ACC is not an advantage when you're only going to be 8th in a good year.

GoDores
04-02-2016, 05:14 PM
The optimistic side of me is hoping Bryce knew Vandy was in the finalizing stages with someone else, hopefully Marshall or another top choice.

The other side of me is hoping Williams didn't drag his feet with Drew. Vandy doesn't move fast in these situations.

kentubbybasketball
04-02-2016, 05:34 PM
I honestly would have been happy if Vandy hires Drew because as a conference opponent he doest scare me at all. To me that's not much of a loss, unless you get somebody else with an even lesser reaume.

Dawgilicious
04-02-2016, 05:44 PM
Is their confirmation of Drew to GT?

GoDores
04-02-2016, 08:29 PM
I scrolled past and read it, but looking back it was only sources. It hasn't been confirmed yet.

Wave&Dawgs
04-03-2016, 09:00 PM
Wave, we didn't have divisions all 14 of Stans' years but further he won more SECW titles than anybody, which is my point. That's pretty good for MSU. You guys gave that up.

BTW, you do realize that your current coach got fired at UCLA right and only could get MSU to hire him. Pot meet kettle.

Yes, he could "only" get MSU, a power 5 school that has had some success over the past two decades. Absolutely comparable to how stans could only land a job at WKU. Please.

Wave&Dawgs
04-03-2016, 09:02 PM
Maybe Vandy should have gone after Stans since he is a guarantee of SEC success, right?

kentubbybasketball
04-03-2016, 09:08 PM
Yes, he could "only" get MSU, a power 5 school that has had some success over the past two decades. Absolutely comparable to how stans could only land a job at WKU. Please.
Well, I'm confused. You are qualifying Stans' success a few posts ago and now you're saying "MSU has had some succsess over the past two decades," which is all tied to Stans. BTW, you criticize Stans for only getting WKU... last I checked WKU has been to the Sweet 16 more recent, has a more recent conference title, and NCAAT bid. You will NOT slam the WKU job without getting called on it.

But, again, nothing on the fact that you guys hired a fired coach yourself, who everybody disliked at his last job. MSU is a very steep drop from UCLA, just as you're acting like WKU is from MSU, although WKU has as many final fours as MSU and has a better history.

Let's not be cocky or arrogant about MSU's place in the pecking order. lol

GoDores
04-04-2016, 12:02 AM
I have never seen so much conflicting information in a coaching search. This afternoon I thought we were about to hire Marshall, then Bryce Drew became the lead candidate again...then Drew was going to Georgia Tech. There's also one guy who swears we are deep with Mike Brey.

kentubbybasketball
04-04-2016, 06:29 AM
At some point you gotta let the process play out. Typically after the final four dominos start to dropm

GatorMan32
04-04-2016, 07:45 AM
Conflicting info is all that happens in coaching searches TBH

GoDores
04-04-2016, 12:10 PM
Sounds like Bryce Drew is our guy now. I'm good with that. I'm not gonna call this a done deal though until I hear it officially announced.

I hope all the details come out, but it sounds like we made a serious run at Marshall and were pretty close.

kentubbybasketball
04-04-2016, 12:33 PM
Conflicting info is all that happens in coaching searches TBH

Exactly. Imagine at a place like Florida or Alabama football where there are so many people "in the know."

kentubbybasketball
04-04-2016, 12:42 PM
Drew makes sense by the way. Coaching family. Individual success. NBA connections. The anti-Stallings in terms of being defensive-minded. I will say that offense is more aesthetically-pleasing, and Stallings' teams could score and worked solid offense. Drew's style might be called "boring" after 3 years if he's not been successful. I'd say it's a good hire. I don't think he's the grand slam that Rick Barnes, Bruce Pearl, and Ben Howland have been lately, but I don't blame Vandy for this. Can't ridicule this one.

VandyChuck
04-04-2016, 01:43 PM
Drew makes sense by the way. Coaching family. Individual success. NBA connections. The anti-Stallings in terms of being defensive-minded. I will say that offense is more aesthetically-pleasing, and Stallings' teams could score and worked solid offense. Drew's style might be called "boring" after 3 years if he's not been successful. I'd say it's a good hire. I don't think he's the grand slam that Rick Barnes, Bruce Pearl, and Ben Howland have been lately, but I don't blame Vandy for this. Can't ridicule this one.

Would love to see the combined record of these 'grand slam' hires for this year.

Vandy shot for Gregg Marshall, couldn't get him. Marshall's heavy reliance on JUCO's probably was a factor. They instead got a guy who has won his league 4 out of the last 5 years, and steadily climbed in the Ken Pomery ratings each year...Well past where his father ever had them. Young, energetic guy who can breathe some life and excitement back into the program.

Oh another perk is that it might piss off an Ole Miss basketball fan or two...Or maybe there aren't any, I don't know.

kentubbybasketball
04-04-2016, 02:24 PM
I doubt it was good. All of them had losing seasons afterall. I'm not sure they hired those guys for year one (throw in Avery Johnson there also for that matter). That said, all four of them to a man was hired after the previous coach had been fired. Bryce Drew is lucky that he's going to a program where that's not the case. Actually, the previous Vandy coach did well enough in 17 years to get a better job. Drew is facing the pressure of having to keep an NCAAT team there, and it's a veteran team who might treat Drew as a "substitute coach" if he doesn't get control of them (a la the reports out of Iowa State with Steve Prohm this year). In five years, Avery, Howland, Pearl, and/or Barnes will have their programs passed where Stallings has left Vandy and past where Drew will take them IMO.

GoDores
04-07-2016, 02:15 PM
It was interesting to hear Williams say Vandy had serious discussion with 5 candidates, all were head coaches. I'd love to know who the other 4 were. Drew also clearly chose the Vandy job instead of Ga Tech.

Not taking anything away from Drew. I think this could end up being a really solid hire.

As was posted above: Avery, Howland, Pearl, Barnes, and Drew. Let's see how things shake out over the next 3 years.

kentubbybasketball
04-07-2016, 02:28 PM
There's not a weak coach in our league. Before somebody mentions Jones, he's had success at North Texas and LSU.

MKfromPA
04-09-2016, 03:31 PM
That's the thing though, what does Howland guarantee? With Stans you had a guarantee 20 win season and an SECW title every other year at least. Howland has a good class coming but that's still not a guarantee of being better than what Stans was.

I tend to agree.

I'm going to laugh if Stallings tears it up with Pittsburgh. I don't expect much the next two years but if he can recruit as well as it is said, then he ought to do well here.

VandyChuck
04-10-2016, 01:08 AM
I tend to agree.

I'm going to laugh if Stallings tears it up with Pittsburgh. I don't expect much the next two years but if he can recruit as well as it is said, then he ought to do well here.

I have almost zero doubt that Stallings will tear it up at Pitt. It just wasn't gonna happen here in Nashville. It was time for a change. Best case scenario for both parties.

MKfromPA
04-10-2016, 09:04 AM
I have almost zero doubt that Stallings will tear it up at Pitt. It just wasn't gonna happen here in Nashville. It was time for a change. Best case scenario for both parties.

Thanks. I appreciate it. I hope Stallings does.

You're right about a change of scenery. Some coaches get caught in a rut, and this can be what gets them out. I might argue the same for Jamie Dixon. He hadn't done much in recent seasons, aside from the NCAAT. Maybe coaching in TCU will do him better.

I wish y'all the best with your new coach. I'd think Vandy will challenge UK, A&M, in the coming seasons. I think KT mentioned in a post... this thread or in another thread... that Vandy typically wins the division title every other year or every third year. So the new coach may aid in that frequency.

Wave&Dawgs
04-10-2016, 10:34 PM
Drew makes sense by the way. Coaching family. Individual success. NBA connections. The anti-Stallings in terms of being defensive-minded. I will say that offense is more aesthetically-pleasing, and Stallings' teams could score and worked solid offense. Drew's style might be called "boring" after 3 years if he's not been successful. I'd say it's a good hire. I don't think he's the grand slam that Rick Barnes, Bruce Pearl, and Ben Howland have been lately, but I don't blame Vandy for this. Can't ridicule this one.

Oh so Ben Howland is a "grand slam hire" now? Just a few posts ago you were downing him for getting fired at UCLA and only being able to get a job such as MSU. I guess whatever is convenient to your point, huh?

kentubbybasketball
04-11-2016, 07:08 AM
Do you disagree? I'm confused. Howland is a grand slam at the level of MSU. Duke, UNC, or UCLA fans would cry if he were their coach.

Wave&Dawgs
04-11-2016, 07:36 AM
No, I do think he was a great hire, but you have been ****ting on the hire pretty much since it was made because you were butthurt at it coming at the expense of Ray, so it's pretty disingenuous for you to suddenly call it a "home run hire" when it suits your point.

msudawg4life
04-11-2016, 03:01 PM
I don't believe Tubby ever said it was a bad hire for MSU...I just do not think he liked the way in which it all went down between Ray and MSU and then MSU picking up Howland. I may be wrong though..

kentubbybasketball
04-11-2016, 03:04 PM
I don't believe Tubby ever said it was a bad hire for MSU...I just do not think he liked the way in which it all went down between Ray and MSU and then MSU picking up Howland. I may be wrong though..

Thanks, bro. You always have my back. It's not that hard to understand. MSU got a coach that has been to 3 straight final fours (only K and Izzo have done that among current coaches). He's clearly a good coach. Does that really change the fact that MSU did Ray wrong? In one word: NOPE!

And, listen, again for a program like MSU, getting Howland is great. Let's face it, MSU needs Howland more than he needs MSU. It's a great hire for that level of program. I personally wouldn't want him at UK. The context of this whole conversation that Wave seems to not get is we are talking about SEC coaching hires. When you factor in that maybe Howland is the 6th best coach in the league, yeah I'd say we're doing pretty good with our hires. THat's the context of the point.

kentubbybasketball
04-11-2016, 03:05 PM
No, I do think he was a great hire

Okay just checking. You seem too ready to criticize my compliment.

NCMISSSTFAN
04-12-2016, 07:52 AM
Thanks, bro. You always have my back. It's not that hard to understand. MSU got a coach that has been to 3 straight final fours (only K and Izzo have done that among current coaches). He's clearly a good coach. Does that really change the fact that MSU did Ray wrong? In one word: NOPE!

And, listen, again for a program like MSU, getting Howland is great. Let's face it, MSU needs Howland more than he needs MSU. It's a great hire for that level of program. I personally wouldn't want him at UK. The context of this whole conversation that Wave seems to not get is we are talking about SEC coaching hires. When you factor in that maybe Howland is the 6th best coach in the league, yeah I'd say we're doing pretty good with our hires. THat's the context of the point.

I can agree with that. I personally didn't like the way Ray was fired either, especially with all the injuries he dealt with and being there for only 3 years trying to fix what Stans left behind. But Howland was a huge hire for MSU, I know he had a rough 1st year but he sure had our guys playing hard every night. Next season he brings in his guys (a top 5 class nationally) to go along with Q, Ready, Holman and maybe Newman. I think we will start seeing his worth soon. My only hope is that he has MSU as an attractive job again before he leaves because my gut feeling is once he gets us back in the right direction, he will probably want to coach at a more basketball rich tradition school to end his career, hopefully I'm wrong though.

Also, I know we've gone off subject in this thread but what do you think about Stans taking the WKU head coaching job?

msudawg4life
04-12-2016, 09:28 AM
I know some ppl don't like the way Ray went out and I think those opinions will not change so I'm not asking to enter those waters again.....but does anyone here actually believe he would of been able to get MSU over the hump in the SEC or would his ceiling of prob been reached this past year and would we have been looking for a new coach anyways? I know what I think...but I'm interested to hear an honest opinion of those other MSU fans here and ppl who know SEC basketball in general.

kentubbybasketball
04-12-2016, 12:24 PM
Well Howland had a losing record with last year's team. So the writing was on the wall. My issue is why did you hire him in the first place???? What was the reasoning. Would you have expected other results looking back on it?

msudawg4life
04-12-2016, 02:48 PM
Well Howland had a losing record with last year's team. So the writing was on the wall. My issue is why did you hire him in the first place???? What was the reasoning. Would you have expected other results looking back on it?

Yes a losing record...but that team played better overall then the final record they had IMO. I think Ben is a much better player developer then the previous coach...you can recruit good talent..but if you are not able to develop them then what is the use.

NCMISSSTFAN
04-12-2016, 04:26 PM
Honestly, I think our team would have eventually improved some with Ray, but overall I truly don't think he would have had us back in SEC contention yearly like Stans did at one point and Howland will eventually do IMO.

msudawg4life
04-12-2016, 05:44 PM
Honestly, I think our team would have eventually improved some with Ray, but overall I truly don't think he would have had us back in SEC contention yearly like Stans did at one point and Howland will eventually do IMO.

ok and for what reasons would you say Ray wouldn't be able to get MSU back to where it wants to be compared to howland?

kentubbybasketball
04-12-2016, 06:32 PM
Yes a losing record...but that team played better overall then the final record they had IMO. I think Ben is a much better player developer then the previous coach...you can recruit good talent..but if you are not able to develop them then what is the use.

But the record matters, right? Whether they were playing better or not doesn't matter. Becuase let's face it MSU was better in Ray's third year than the record indicated also. But, the point is you hired a guy with no head coaching experience from an assistant's spot at a program that was a middling power school itself. I mean, Ray was set up to fail and AD Stricklin made a bad decision from the get go in hiring him.

NCMISSSTFAN
04-13-2016, 07:23 AM
ok and for what reasons would you say Ray wouldn't be able to get MSU back to where it wants to be compared to howland?

Howland's history is the main reason I say this. Look what he's done at every school he's been to, the man can coach and recruit. And he will be the first to tell you that it all starts with recruiting. You have to have talent in place, coaching matters also but if you don't have the talent, its hard to consistently win. That's one huge thing seperates those two IMO, Howland is going to bring in top 100 guys and coach them up and have them playing hard on both sides of the floor. Ray had a hard time recruiting, but to his credit he did bring structure and discipline back to MSU and his kids played hard for him.

Not bashing Ray because I know he stepped into a different situation at SE Missouri but that team he coached this year went 5-24, he also had about 4 players transfer out of there after the season ended. He's a great guy and I'm pulling for him but he's had a hard time as Head coach so far. Hopefully he gets things going.

kentubbybasketball
04-13-2016, 02:50 PM
My whole point NC though is you push Stans out the door for a guy from a program that was doing worse than MSU had been doing... and he wasn't even the head coach of that program. What was MSU thinking?

NCMISSSTFAN
04-13-2016, 03:40 PM
I can't disagree there, but I think the hire was made in hopes that it would be one of those out of the box hires that worked out. I remember during that time our AD had been told by numerous people in the "know" that Ray was a perfect guy to bring in and head coach a team. He was even receiving praised by Rommie Hummel and a lot of other former players he had coached. Sometimes, especially at a school like MSU, you have to roll the dice and see where they land. It didn't quite work out, but in the end we got a proven Head Coach.

kentubbybasketball
04-13-2016, 05:19 PM
So I guess Robbie Hummel's opinion wasn't good enough to keep him for four years, the amount of time for a fill class to get through???

NCMISSSTFAN
04-14-2016, 07:32 AM
Your preaching to the choir, I said all along Ray deserved more time but unfortunately it wasn't given to him. That being said as an MSU fan you have to move on and I'm happy about the Howland hire.